Comments on: Utah women come to Mount Pleasant to spread Mormon mission

By: Mariette Schuett

Mariette Schuett — Mon, 01 Feb 2010 03:28:27 +0000

Twitter are 100% the way to go

By: Chris Price

Chris Price — Thu, 31 Dec 2009 15:42:16 +0000

Hello Ted,
Well New Years Eve and all is well (?) I hope that you had a nice Christmas.
Many books can in fact be read at face value but some books need an enquiring even an open mind. Holy Scripture needs both these, plus a genuine desire to know the truth. When we are speaking of Gods revealed truth then sincere prayer is also a vital ingredient. See Moroni 10:4~5 in the Book of Mormon.
No one has the right to force any viewpoint onto another. Unfortunately there are those who are trying to coerce legislators into legalising ‘same sex’ relationships into law and onto an equal footing with the divinely instituted state of marriage, that, being the marriage between one man and one woman. The Church as a witness of and upholder of Gods law is resisting that motion and seeking for the status quo. That is not forcing our beliefs on anyone.
In your final comment, I actually agree with you. If the missionaries in question promise “I will get back to you” then they should get back to you. The failure to get back could have been due to having been moved to another area, but that said they should have acted on the promise. Sadly none of us is perfect. Present company excepted of course.

By: Ted

Ted — Thu, 31 Dec 2009 01:17:56 +0000

Good evening Chris,

In relation to your first paragraph, I read your books at face value. If it says the sky is Blue, I take it to mean the sky is Blue and not purple. By doing so you can rest assured I take the meaning as it is written.

In relation to your next statement, would you agree that I have no right to enforce my definition of marriage on you than you can enforce yours upon me? If so, then we are in agreement.

In response to your last paragraph, I agree, there is nothing wrong with “I will get back to you” provided they get back to you, which they do not.

By: Chris Price

Chris Price — Tue, 22 Dec 2009 21:02:04 +0000

Hi Ted,
My problem with your first statement is your claim to have reviewed LDS “books.” From your many statements and questions and failure to correctly read my replies I can see clearly that you have not prayerfully read with an open mind and an honest desire to know the actual truth.
Where marriage is concerned our beliefs go much deeper that either Civil marriage or indeed those conducted by other Churches. I have previously explained this to you. The Church is not trying to enforce our concept of marriage onto anyone; rather we are looking to keep the Status Quo in that marriage be only between a man and a woman. The USA legislators may well reject the Church supported motion, and that will be their right. (Other organizations also support that view). If you or indeed anyone else wants to live in a same gender relationship, then again that is your choice.
We are created in the image of God. Man has free agency and his thoughts and ways are quite often in accord with his thoughts and ways; However, many choose to live, think and act in ways that are contrary to His will, that is the exercise of free agency and is their right. A faithful Latter Day Saint will be striving to live in accordance with His Holy will. The Church strives to call these people to repent and come unto Christ, which indeed is our right.
I personally do not see that the Bible supports your stance in some respects it totally condemns your views.
I am flattered that you see my responses as “one step up from the missionaries,” However I must modesty refute this, the only difference is that being retired I have more time to reply. Whereas they have been called to serve, they are normally quite young and generally are preaching a simple message and testimony of the Gospel and the Lords restored Church. That is over simplified but makes the point. There is nothing wrong with the “I’ll get back to you response” an off the cuff reply may be misleading, even incorrect. Surely in a desire to know the truth it is better to wait for an accurate and correct reply.
I will be away from home over Christmas, so if you respond to this ‘tome’ I may not be able to reply straight away. Enjoy your Christmas however you celebrate it.

By: Ted

Ted — Tue, 22 Dec 2009 16:49:06 +0000

When keeping with your faith, i have no doubt all your responses are in truth and correctness. However when we review your books at face value against your statements, you do not display the same truth and correctness.

You acknowledge you do not have a copyright on marriage outside of your religion, yet the actions of your religion believe otherwise as they attempt to enforce their marriage code on non-believers.

So we are the image of god, do you mean only in body or do you also mean in action and in thoughts as well?

So you acknowledge the bible is the word of god with limited error. Fine enough, so my follow-up questions would be, what are the limited errors and who determined what these errors are?

If i am understanding you correctly, you say i am grasping at straws, however from side, i am looking for answers. The questions I ask are as written in the bible, yet you seem to discredit.

Dont get me wrong, I am greatly enjoying our conversations and value your insight, however, your responses are only one step-up from the missionaries who come to my door and have no responses other than “I’ll get back to you”.

By: Chris Price

Chris Price — Mon, 21 Dec 2009 20:33:38 +0000

Well what a good start; you conceded that I was right on something. Unfortunately, without wishing to sound arrogant I humbly submit that I am right on all matters that we have discussed.
No, I agree, in a worldly legal definition no one has a copyright on man made marriages be they civil or of any other non LDS faiths. However the LDS Church through Gods Prophet does have sole rights to marriage that is recognised by God, which are performed in His Holy Temples for Time & Eternity. Many man made marriage services actually state “until death us do part” or words to that effect. The Law of both of our countries recognise that a marriage is at an end when one of the parties dies. A faithful Latter Day Saint considers his or her marriage in full force even after the passing of a loved companion.
Man was indeed created in Gods image, and marriage became a basis, Gods way for the continuing male, female relationship, enabling them to carry out Gods command to multiply and replenish the Earth. Man was also given free agency to choose, they could follow Gods path leading to Eternal Life within the Celestial Kingdom or they could choose other paths of their own choosing; this would mean that they could not qualify for this exalted state. Without knowledge of the True Gospel some have chosen very good paths and will be rewarded accordingly. Others have chosen sinful paths, sometimes in error, often wilfully. Sadly Homosexuals, whether innocently through lack of knowledge or understanding, possibly even in wilful disobedience to Gods Law, fit somewhere in the latter groupings. They were born in Gods image but sadly they no longer reflect it. Certainly even if the law of our Countries finally concede to pressure, their ‘marriage’ will not be a lawful Eternal one in Gods eyes. He of course recognises that they would be lawful under civil law.
When we arrive at the Judgement Bar of God and have to answer for our actions in our mortal lives I personally would probably struggle even unable to justify some of the things I have done in my life. I doubt that you will be able to justify your position, it is untenable.
As for your “religious texts’ comment, I think you need to more carefully read my comments again, they are as follows:
“You appear to have misread what I wrote. I will simplify it for you. We believe the Bible to be the word of God as far as it is translated correctly; we also believe the Book of Mormon to be the word of God. Other Editions of the Bible, The Koran and the Tanakh etc. are all sources that can supply insight. The Bible has been translated by many people over the years and contains some errors and omissions. We can determine the truth by listening to Gods Prophet here on the Earth today”.
The beauty of our position is that we have moved on, but only in accordance with Gods Law. On that we stand firm. The Church is true and today we have a Prophet who leads it in the person of President Thomas S Monson. Please grasp this simple truth and investigate before it becomes eternally too late. At the moment you are only grasping at straws. You have had, not only my testimony but also of Shirlee and others that have responded. I again affirm to you that God lives, That Jesus Christ is our Lord & Saviour and that The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints is the Lords true Church here upon the Earth today and Jesus Christ stands at its head, with Thomas S Monson as His Prophet who presides over the Church at this time. You are criticising without proper knowledge of what you are speaking about, your claims have no basis in fact. I lovingly invite you to properly investigate the Church, you will be amazed at how wrong you have been.

By: Ted

Ted — Mon, 21 Dec 2009 13:59:17 +0000

Good morning Chris,

You are correct, that should have read “Interpreted”.

Trying to condense your reply into four points;

Mormons, let alone any other religion, do not have the copyright on marriage. That being said, you do not get to dictate to any legislative body of how “Your” god wants all non-believers to live.

Man was created in Gods image, which means everything we are or could ever be, is a part of god. Whether it is love or hate, heterosexual or homosexual, we are gods image. Hence god is full of as much heterosexual love as he is homosexual love.

Again, all religious texts have been translated by man which you agreed to and in conjunction full of error. To that, how did you select which ones are in error?

You argue that homosexuals should just move on? It is just as easy to argue that Mormons should just move on.

By: Chris Price

Chris Price — Sun, 20 Dec 2009 21:59:07 +0000

Hello Ted,
I am not sure whether your first line is facetious or a genuine mistake in that you have used the word “interrupted.” Many, possibly most Bible scholars accept that the Bible has got errors, misinterpretations and omissions. The great strength of the LDS position is that The Book of Mormon is another Testament of Jesus Christ and stands together with the Bible as witnesses of the truth, whether you personally accept this is basically irrelevant – It is the truth. For this relationship see Ezekiel 37:19. Through revelation from God we know that this verse refers to these two books.
How you arrive at your statement regarding my understanding in paragraph 2 I fail to fathom. Down through the centuries Marriage has been recognised by all civilised people as being between a Man & a Woman, it is not just the LDS view; it is a view held by the vast majority of people throughout the World.
You say “this is your Gods definition” – in fact He is the God of us all including yourself. You should remember that! In Genesis 20:2 we, including you & I are commanded “Thou shalt have no other Gods before me.” The plural “Gods” in this sense relates to man at that time worshipping Graven images etc. Today mans Gods are what ‘they make’ of them, Cars, Money, Property, Pop Stars etc. etc.
I “dress” nothing up, I am purely telling you the way it is in accordance with Gods Law, as contained in the scriptures and revealed through His servants the Prophets.
Within the Law we all have freedom to choose the way we live and our lifestyles. Personally I would add as long as our actions do not infringe upon the rights of others. The LDS Church is not denying your right to live what ever lifestyle you choose. In actual fact Homosexual people are trying to force society to accept their unnatural way of life as normal, as witness the violent confrontation over Proposition 8 in California.
In my previous notes I said “The Church SUPPORTED legislation that homosexuals should NOT be discriminated against when it comes to matters of employment and housing. So we do recognise Gay Rights but Gods Law that marriage should be between one man & one woman is Gods way, He did not create a third sex, hence we sustain Gods law and want to see it enshrined in the law of the land.
I have written before that God and His Church love the Homosexual as a Man but not his sexual practices. When He place Adam & Eve upon the Earth he commanded them to go forth and multiply, meaning to procreate, to have children. Homosexual relationships cannot be a marriage because this would be impossible for them to do.
I do not see why they have a problem and a need to be so in the face of modern society, they are now largely treated as more that equal, why not just get on and live their lives and let the rest of society also get on with their own?

By: Ted

Ted — Sun, 20 Dec 2009 02:53:47 +0000

Good evening Chris,

So you agree, the bible is the word of god as interrupted by man.

You then also understand why your religion suffers from so much anger as your religion encourages legislators to vote for your definition of marriage. To that end, you deserve all the hate you receive from which as you are enforcing your beliefs on everyone else.

As already stated, this is your gods definition of religion, I say again YOUR gods definition.

Doesn’t matter how you dress it up, you altered gods directive to fit mans law.

I thought it was pretty clear, your religions infringement of others rights.

Why would we need to move to the Book of Mormons when we already agree that Mormons do not recognize gay rights?

By: Chris Price

Chris Price — Thu, 17 Dec 2009 16:52:40 +0000

Hi Ted,
You appear to have misread what I wrote. I will simplify it for you. We believe the Bible to be the word of God as far as it is translated correctly; we also believe the Book of Mormon to be the word of God. Other Editions of the Bible, The Koran and the Tanakh etc. are all sources that can supply insight. The Bible has been translated by many people over the years and contains some errors and omissions. We can determine the truth by listening to Gods Prophet here on the Earth today.
I do know what the Church stance is in relation to Homosexuals; I did not know the specifics of your legislative program. I repeat it again to ensure you understand it: The Church encourages legislators to vote against homosexual marriage. Stating its policy that marriage should be between one man and one woman. Incidentally
The Church SUPPORTED legislation that homosexuals should NOT be discriminated against when it comes to matters of employment and housing.
As already stated God created Man and Woman and decreed marriage between them to be the right way. He did not create a third sex without the power of procreation.
Latter Day Saints, Christians, are required to be in the world, not of the world. We believe in being subject to kings, presidents, rulers, and magistrates, in obeying, honouring, and sustaining the law. God gave man free agency, the ability to choose the right or the wrong path and will not interfere with our choices. Unfortunately some have chosen the latter, this often infringes upon personal liberty and leads to conflict of views. This put the Church in an untenable position, we ourselves could not impose our way of life on others, hence the petition to God for His guidance.
You have not really answered any of my questions, rather commenting upon my beliefs with different questions. Perhaps you might like to state the basis of your clear hostility to the LDS Church? Who or what is your God? How do Latter Day Saints intrude on your life or restrict your freedom to live in the way you opt for?
Up until now I have not quoted from The Book of Mormon, Another Testament of Jesus Christ. I would again urge you to properly investigate the Church, read the Book of Mormon in the light of Moroni 10:4 which reads: “And when ye shall receive these things, I would exhort you that ye would ask God, the Eternal Father, in the name of Christ, if these things are not true; and if ye shall ask with a sincere heart, with real intent, having faith in Christ, he will manifest the truth of it unto you, by the power of the Holy Ghost”. That is how I came to know the Book of Mormon to be true. You too can know the peace and joy that reading it can bring to your life, be a doer rather than a complainer.